Forum Topic
chthon
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 5:13 AMThe franchise doesn't paint the best picture of scientific curiosity, science carried out by commercial organisations and especially biological research.
Yet science fiction fans (supposedly pro-science) love it.
Or am I being paranoid?
16 Replies
Kane77
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 5:43 AMYou are absolutly right. Thats one of the main movie philosophy points of Prometheus or similar movies. And thats what many people feel uncomfordable with. A future, perfectly designed, engineered, perfectly DNA-sober, rid of diseases, high tech.
Thats the nice side.
The other side is of course, basically a world, completly in the hands of some few multi-trillion-multi-national-quasi-government operating companies. ( up to New World Order-socialistic-style. Perfect corporationism. 1984/ Equilibrium..)
[b]
there is nothing left.[/b]
no need for religion. No need for humanism, because its kinda post-humanism.
Of course Alien I shows more low tech as an opposite.
NoXWord
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 6:01 AMWhat I see in the Alien franchise is total absence of science. It is put apart in favour of technology, you make money with tech, not with science, unfortunately.
The Company is after technology, and technology can be bad. Science is not bad.
In Prometheus we see "scientists" for the first time: Shaw, Holloway, Fifield, Milburn and Ford are scientists, and in the end they have to follow Weyland's directives, that seem to override their genuine interest (Vickers ordering not to interfere with the potential findings).
Ridley Scott will eventually tell us how the Queen was born.
Right now we have the Deacon; coming soon the Mercury, the May and the Taylor.
Frantz
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 6:07 AMwe just see one side of the future ...and is a dark side ... colonists on lv 426 maybe were very happy like maybe Shaw and Holloway were very happy on earth before leaving ....PArker and Brett did complain like alot of workers around the world today ...so its seems to be that cannot be called a dystopian movie like 1984 or Equilibrium .
The Evil weight of weyland yutani over the human population is only a speculation of geeks , after all the build better worlds ...what there is wrong with it ?
The only evil things we see from the company is the infamous directive 937 and the end of Alien 3 ...in aliens is Burke that do all the mess . About Alien 3 is all the script that was a mess .
Kane77
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 6:16 AM@Franz
yeah, dystropian world as an extreme..as a fact, we know very little about the earth societies in the Alien universe, at the end of Alien4 of course Paris looks somewhat post-world war 3..
juston
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 6:25 AMI agree with NoX... there isn't that much science to be found in the Alien movies. Now that we're being introduced to more science/scientists in Prometheus we may be able to make a call as to whether the movie is anti-science or not. If it is, that's unfortunate and it will negatively impact my enjoyment of the movie.
centrosphere
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 7:07 AMI have made this point many weeks ago: if "Prometheus" lends credibility to von Daniken theories, it is completely anti-science, negates darwinism and is a friend of the "intelligent design" proponents. Sad, but true.
NoXWord
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 7:17 AMIn the end it's just a movie. There are good movies that deal with the most ridiculous subjects, so if Prometheus is going to fall under this category, it won't change my views on quacks.
Ridley Scott will eventually tell us how the Queen was born.
Right now we have the Deacon; coming soon the Mercury, the May and the Taylor.
chthon
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 7:21 AMUnless the idea is that the SJs made a small 'tweak' to the genome of some primate back in the day and it had a huge impact (sentience). I think this is inferred by today's David 8 tweet.
Frantz
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 7:22 AMScience isnt good , smart , stupid , evil by default ... science is the natural research of the man to find the truth into things and why things are ... so is a never ending journey and can be ( as the man is ) good , smart , stupid or evil ... If science will find that behind everything there is an intelligent design or that darwinism is wrong it will end to be science ? No it will have just made new discoveries .
( and yes noxword is right ...its a sci fi movie come on . )
Ender
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 7:40 AMNoXWord I dont think you can differentiate between science and technology, one equates to the other really and you can, certainly make money from science.
Also I think "the company's" quest for technological supremacy and the scorched earth left in its trail is more or less a metaphor for current and future "evil" It is absolutely implied in the Alien franchise that the company is evil, "building better worlds" rings a tone of irony.
However my point would be that the franchise is not "anti-science" it's just that there is an obvious case of good vs evil in the films and this translates to:
greed leads to science which leads to evil - hate the scientist not the science
chthon
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 8:01 AMIt seems the tool of choice for Evil is genetic science.
The tool of choice for Good is flame-throwers and nuclear bombs.
Hmmm.
NoXWord
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 8:04 AMThat's the common misconception, Enderwiggin, science=technology.
They are now deeply intertwined and one can't do without another to some extent, but their scopes and methods are very different. You can apply science to technology and apply technology to science.
A nuclear weapon is science bent to technology, a synchrotron is technology bent to science.
Physicists are scientists, not necessarily technicians; engineers are technicians, not necessarily scientists (I am an engineer who supports science).
But I agree with the overall meaning of your post, though I would put the last sentence a bit differently:
Greed can lead science towards harmful technology - hate the scientist not the science
Ridley Scott will eventually tell us how the Queen was born.
Right now we have the Deacon; coming soon the Mercury, the May and the Taylor.
Ender
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 8:35 AMNoXWord I think we're singing off the same hymn sheet here and I concede science and technology are not identical but....
One could argue science without application (which requires technology) is just philosophy
What sort of engineering do you do btw?
jujutsuka
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 10:40 AMTo me, the films are not anti-science, but anti-narcissistic-science.
In Alien, W-Y orders the crew to bring back any specimens. In Aliens, Burke orders the colonists to bring back any specimens from the derelict. In Alien 3, the W-Y team arrives at the end to harvest the specimen from Ripley. And so on. Prometheus seems like it'll be much the same.
In this universe, the powers that be believe that we are humans, it is all about us, us, us, and the entirety of space is our sphere of influence. (Commence judicious application of the SJ beatstick.)
Fall down seven times, get up eight.
centrosphere
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 10:48 AMNoXWord,
Of course it´s a movie. But movies, books, even songs are the material of what the "spirit of the times" is made. They can powerfully influence the "real world".
So if "Prometheus" brings some autorithy to the "intelligent design" theory _ and see, not through rational arguments but using a rethorical artifact _ it will not of course change my viewpoint or yours, but will have an impact over millions of people that are more easily influenced _ like children (be it or not PG 13).
This said, of course I don´t doubt that the movie will probably be excellent entertainment to everybody.
Kane77
MemberOvomorphMay-03-2012 10:56 AMyeah, science is science. The question is , who handles it, in whose hands the most powerful and important technology is.
bad: Ripley, fleeing from the Xeno, trying to disengage the selfdesctruct machanism, crying MU-TH-OR..
good: DNA-bio-tech in non-greedy hand, making mankind a better place..
Add A Reply
