Alien Movie Universe

Hive Mind or Independent Intelligence?

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Myrddin365

MemberFacehuggerJan-27-2017 2:47 PM

This topic got me thinking. I want to present a premise and let's assume it's true for the sake of discussion. 

Premise: the nightmares experienced by survivors of Xeno encounters are telepathic projections from the Xenos themselves. This means they can project telepathic signals across great distances indefinitely and with very little lag time. 

So collective consciousness, hive mind, Independent agent, or what mix of the three?

 

Safe? Of course he isn't safe, but he's good!

55 Replies

S.M

MemberXenomorphJan-27-2017 2:54 PM

I tend to put it down to PTSD.

Telepathic projections was used extensively in the original comic series however. People - who'd never seen or heard of the Aliens - dreamed about their mothers, which eventually devolved into nightmares about monsters.

ninXeno426

MemberPraetorianJan-27-2017 2:55 PM

Excellent idea myrddin.Ripley is endlessly haunted by nightmares.I think this warrants further exploration.

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

Myrddin365

MemberFacehuggerJan-27-2017 2:59 PM

PTSD is more night terrors and insomnia than specific recurring nightmares. At least that's what my buddies told me who got a taste of life in the sandbox. 

Safe? Of course he isn't safe, but he's good!

ninXeno426

MemberPraetorianJan-27-2017 3:00 PM

It is true about the ptsd.I was reading this essay from John Scalzi about Ripley and one of the things he mentioned about her character was the ptsd.But the nightmare idea is intriguing.

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

S.M

MemberXenomorphJan-27-2017 3:07 PM

"PTSD is more night terrors and insomnia than specific recurring nightmares. At least that's what my buddies told me who got a taste of life in the sandbox."

I don't know enough about it.

It's interesting that Ripley didn't suffer any nightmares on Fiorina when she was carrying a Queen, and there was an actual Alien nearby - but did have nightmares at Gateway when there were none.

Myrddin365

MemberFacehuggerJan-27-2017 3:07 PM

Thanks! It certainly got my mind going, so I thought I'd share. Ripley DEFINITELY had PTSD, it's just that the same nightmares over and over again wasn't a common symptom with my army buddies.

Alien 3 really didn't address nightmares. You hardly ever saw her sleeping, though.  And it could be argued that Golic was having telepathic interference while he was awake. Especially in the novelization.

Safe? Of course he isn't safe, but he's good!

S.M

MemberXenomorphJan-27-2017 3:17 PM

Nah, Golic was a just a nut.

Ripley sleeps pretty soundly after bonking Clemens. Though her waking up was framed in such a way that it happened just as Murphy got diced.

ninXeno426

MemberPraetorianJan-27-2017 3:21 PM

My neighbor is a marine and suffers form ptsd.He's known to get pretty violent at times,but that's all i really know.He hasn't had an incident in a long while any way.

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

ali81

MemberNeomorphJan-27-2017 3:22 PM

is it the individual xeno projecting these images or is it the queen? from the comics I got the impression its the queen

S.M

MemberXenomorphJan-27-2017 3:23 PM

In the comics t was the Queen Bionational had bred on Earth.

Myrddin365

MemberFacehuggerJan-27-2017 3:28 PM

So we have one for hive mind.  That's a good start. How does that make the most sense to you?

Safe? Of course he isn't safe, but he's good!

ali81

MemberNeomorphJan-27-2017 3:28 PM

I get the impression the xeno is capable of telepathically seeking out its prey. it always seems to know where u r. they can also be commanded/ communicate even, with the queen but I think the ability to project images and fear into people might be a bit far. id say the queen would be the only one with that ability which makes her more terrifying and seperates her from the rest. think there has to be some sort of difference which makes her stand out from the xeno other than just sheer size and egg laying ability

ali81

MemberNeomorphJan-27-2017 3:33 PM

I actually think the whole species is so much more complex than originally thought. so many possibilities. theyr adaptability is theyr most lethal quality. lone xeno can egg morph and start a hive by itself in a limited resource situation. larger host situations, they adapt and a queen is berthed. theyr telepathic ability makes me think from birth, the xeno takes in so much info about is environment. is it a lone xeno? is there a queen? number of hosts etc. I think at the first molting stage, this is where the xeno becomes either xeno or queen, after it has taken in its environment. I think having both concepts makes it a more lethal and indestructible species. sorry I know this wasn't very helpful

Myrddin365

MemberFacehuggerJan-27-2017 3:34 PM

@ali81That's a reasonable assertion.

Like I said, though let's assume the premise is true for the purposes of this discussion.  Another one for hive mind with explanations of their reasoning. I like it.

Safe? Of course he isn't safe, but he's good!

ali81

MemberNeomorphJan-27-2017 3:35 PM

ok, I think they r hardwire for a hive mentality. ill stop there before I start rambling again

ninXeno426

MemberPraetorianJan-27-2017 3:36 PM

I think i agree with the hive mind.In Aliens there attacks seemed pretty coordinated as if the queen was directing them.Individual xeno's may have been smart enough too back off,but i think that if the queen was controlling them then she may have been willing to use as many as she could to get to them.

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

ali81

MemberNeomorphJan-27-2017 3:36 PM

the fact even a lone xeno is naturally programmed to start a hive adds to hive mentality

Myrddin365

MemberFacehuggerJan-27-2017 3:36 PM

@S.M. clearly Golic was a nut, but did that make him more susceptible to the projection or less?

Safe? Of course he isn't safe, but he's good!

S.M

MemberXenomorphJan-27-2017 3:38 PM

Don't care for the hive mind concept.

Never thought the Queen was terribly intelligent either.  She sat there oblivious to the AP station about to go critical.

ninXeno426

MemberPraetorianJan-27-2017 3:41 PM

I believe when it comes to Golic,they had a plotline that they dropped where he teamed up the dog/runner alien.If it actually happened then it may have been communicating with him or even controlling him to Some extent.

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

S.M

MemberXenomorphJan-27-2017 3:45 PM

"@S.M. clearly Golic was a nut, but did that make him more susceptible to the projection or less?"

I don't buy the projection concept, so I'll go with "less".

Myrddin365

MemberFacehuggerJan-27-2017 3:45 PM

@ninXeno426 did that make it into the special edition? I haven't watched it yet.

Safe? Of course he isn't safe, but he's good!

Myrddin365

MemberFacehuggerJan-27-2017 3:48 PM

@S.M. I mean, do your thing, but that's kinda the whole premise of this topic... That it's a thing the telepathy.

Safe? Of course he isn't safe, but he's good!

ali81

MemberNeomorphJan-27-2017 3:48 PM

xeno.yeah they were very organised in the river of pain book, though whether its canon or not im not sure, but ants/ bees r very organised. I know what u mean by the golic/ dog-xeno idea. just didn't see that working out tbh so can see why it was dropped. the golic character though could be a similar concept to how the engineers view the xeno, deleted scene ofcourse

SpiteHouse

MemberOvomorphJan-27-2017 3:53 PM

SM

If the Queen was really oblivious to the critical reactor that would suggest an inability to read telepathically.

As far as projecting complex nightmares telepathically, I don't know how that is even possible over vast ranges without using quantum effects. This would suggest an absolutely fearsome intelligence.

The kind of intelligence that would suggest Xenos should be able to build their own space ships. Which they don't.

ninXeno426

MemberPraetorianJan-27-2017 3:54 PM

No unfortunately.Golic has a much larger role,it goes a little more into his fascination with "The Dragon" but not that far.Actor Paul Mcgann expressed disappointment over it not happening.I believe it can still be read though.

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

SpiteHouse

MemberOvomorphJan-27-2017 3:55 PM

The reason I suggested quantum effects is because I assume even telepathy would be subject to the inverse square law, assuming it existed.

Myrddin365

MemberFacehuggerJan-27-2017 3:56 PM

Okay I'm gonna advocate collective consciousness, just to put a twist in things. (Though I'm generally on the side of hive mind.) If they all know what every Xeno knows and act in the most appropriate way to propagate the species in their environment, then widespread colonization/infestation increases the knowledge, and therefore power of the race. Especially when they encounter a new species. 

This also makes it more likely for them to be objects of worship or at least admiration.  It makes more sense for the Queens to be the only ones who communicate like that, though. Adding urgency to drones producing one because they are comparatively blind and alone without one. 

Safe? Of course he isn't safe, but he's good!

ali81

MemberNeomorphJan-27-2017 3:58 PM

it was a fascinating insight into golic in the dragon seens, wish they couldv done more like golic going around, knocking inmates out and dragging them like offerings to the dragon or something like that

SpiteHouse

MemberOvomorphJan-27-2017 3:58 PM

I'm gonna assume that the eggs/facehuggers would lack any sort of collective consciousness/hive mind?

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