Topic How do you classify the "Perfect Organism"?
Posted Aug-02-2016 8:47 PM
Over the last few days, I have been enjoying a great deal of conversation with many of you concerning the Alien mythology and how it could possibly play into the upcoming Alien: Covenant. However, one question has worked its way to the fore of my thoughts: how does one classify the Alien? What type of animal is it - or to which animal group could it be most closely linked? It shares many aspects with both deep-water organisms, insects and reptiles, yet it can evidence a vast array traits that stem from its host. How would you classify it? As always, your thoughts and conjecture on this topic are most welcome, even if you choose to keep them to yourself. :)
Posted Aug-02-2016 11:05 PM
A cat. It has no sense of remorse, lays waste wherever it wants, has no respect for the organisms around it. It toys with its prey and gets sick enjoyment from tormenting others.
I don't think it was coincidence that in Alien, Jonesy looked up at the Alien as it took Brett into the vents, with such an understanding look upon its face. Jonesy couldn't have cared less and I think it and the Xenomorph shared that mutual hatred or everything else that wasn't a cat. It makes perfect sense.
Posted Aug-02-2016 11:26 PM
@S.M @Halloway @Something Real @Chris Pickard
man those are good! lol Cancer, scorpion and Cat! :D
I also see Angler fish, Vampire squid,
bats, horse shoe crabs, spiders, leeches, eels...
"Must be something we haven't seen yet.."__Bishop
Posted Aug-02-2016 11:47 PM
CHRIS PICARD - Hahaha! You almost made me spit wine out on one of my favorite dresses, you goof! Regardless of that near disaster, I absolutely love the satire you have presented! Indeed; Jonesy certainly seemed lax if not altogether indifferent to Brett's rather horrific ending. Perhaps your hypothesis also helps to describe why the Alien simply knocks Jonesy aside in his carrier rather than eating him? Hmm... ;)
Posted Aug-03-2016 12:20 AM
EDIT How would we classify the mechanical traits? How were they induced and how can we see nature create this? The way i see that is if the evolution completes its circle and begin to benefit and ad from technology already available from ex humans, that completes and betters a organism? Just my thought. First-time poster, long-time lurker :)
Posted Aug-03-2016 1:21 AM
ONEX - Welcome to SCIFIED! It is extremely fantastic to see a new face! I find your thoughts on this topic to be most interesting! Indeed, how do the technological aspects of the creature evolve and come into existence? How do they factor into the creature's classification? All very thought-provoking notions! Once again, welcome to SCIFIED! :)
Posted Aug-03-2016 3:02 AM
Same thoughts - alien is a cat ;)
And this has a basis. Alien movie basis on "It! The Terror from Beyond Space". And "It!..." movie basis on book "Black Destroyer" by Van Vogt. And in book monster is just a big cat.
P.S. In AvP2010 xenomorph tail look like a cat tail. LOL.
Posted Aug-03-2016 11:53 AM
Well, they appear to be humanoid creatures, but kill, reproduce without remorse. So human in aspect (head, torso, arms n legs) but the morals of a wild animal, without any "soul".
They are so far beyond any terrestrial species, that comparison is difficult at best.
They can "breathe" in practically any atmosphere, even swim underwater for at least short periods of time.
Impervious to hot/cold temperatures.
Molecular acid for blood.
Unique "sighting" system. IR? Radar?
Exoskeleton, although the head piece and "spikes" might make it hard to maneuver in tight spaces?
In a word, absolutely nothing to compare it to. If by "perfect" you mean the perfect killing organism. Yeah it comes close.
The worst part of our nature.
Which asks the question: what would be the best part of our nature? What the engineers originally seeded with before it was corrupted? That to me would be the perfect organism. Not this abomination.
Posted Aug-03-2016 2:32 PM
CHRIS PICARD LOL yeah could be right!
SM indeed as it originally started.... its origins, Ridley had said before the Black Goo was Bacterial and Bioligical Evil Warefare... The Source said the idea was originally it was a Parasite... (i think they mean the Goo) not the Egg/Face Hugger but Ridley had refereed to Parasites too...
Its not clear about the Goo/Xeno connection and origins, its a Topic with so many clues that are vague and we cant be sure 100% of the connection... but it looks like the Xeno evolved from something related to the Black Goo... but maybe only the stuff in those Urns prehaps... but then we have to ask how is this stuff connected to the Xenomorph... and its a case of Chicken or Egg... which i think Alien Covenant will finally push us to the right path they intend.
But indeed, the Xenomorph could act like a plague, a disease... it is a infestation by a Parasitical Organism that takes on traits from Hosts and Adapts to Environments and its basic use is to Procreate itself at the expensive of native lifeforms... We dont know to what end... i.e as far as if a World is infected, or a Outpost can the Xenomorph survive or do they die out only leaving but the Eggs behind... Which may be what happens?
But yes Cancer is certainly the way it operates..
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
Posted Aug-03-2016 2:41 PM
Is the Xenomorph the Perfect Organism? It depends if we think of being Advanced as Perfect... and having Civilization like Mankind, like the Engineers.
Or we are only considering a Survival Aspect.. So far we are really drawn to the Xenomorph being a Primitive but highly evolved Organism but not quite one that we expect to build ships and city's and to have discussions and communications with other beings.
Nope it seems like a Advanced Ant/Bee Colony... but who knows how far they would explore how Advanced they could be... maybe this is where Weavers Alien 5 comments come in?
If we are looking at the Perfect Organism on Earth, then Ants fall into that category and other insects like Cockroaches....
Millions of years time will Man be on Earth? who knows.. but you can surely expect Ants and Cockroaches to remain... and over Millions of years who knows how Humans will Evolve.... but chances are Ants/Cockroaches will not Evolve no more..
Because for their purpose they are Perfect Organisms..
The Xeno is a more Advanced and Perfect version of those... more deadly, more intelligent, more adaptable to environments. Its Acid Blood is a Advancement over Ants using Acid as a defense (some species can) and their stingers.
We also have hints of the Xenomorph Procreation, we have the Queens and if they can Procreate Asexually that would be Perfect...
We have the Egg Morph, which if its explored to show this is a means of a Drone being able to create a Queen to set up a Colony then again this adds to their Perfection.
Devoid of emotion, only survival instincts would also make them Perfect as emotion.. can be a flaw!
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
Posted Aug-03-2016 10:35 PM
Biomechanoid. Giger went for melding different aspects of some terrestrial animals, but beyond the anthropoid aspect things get divergent. As a zoologist I've thought about this down through the years - and biochemists once supposed silicon (Ash mentions "polarized silicon" in the original) could perhaps support life other than carbon, so who knows? But I've come up with no workaround for how it gains so much mass so quickly after shedding its larval form. Law of conservation of mass, and all. Did the thing eat metal while on the Nostromo, because it didn't seem to be consuming any biomass to get to 8+ feet tall. Much less how it got there in a matter of a few hours after it burst through Kane's chest.
Posted Aug-04-2016 7:41 AM
Indeed that is very correct.... one thing i over looked... i was doing my reply based on the Xenomorph being Perfect which it is not but its close.... but no Cigar.
And indeed needing a Host to Procreate does make a big flaw.... when all Hosts are used and there is nothing left for the Face Huger to use as Hosts and lets assume if Egg Morph is Cannon but requires a certain Organism a certain size (no Egg Morph of Insects to procreate) then indeed eventually the Xenomorph would not be able to procreate....
If they had overtaken a Outpost like Hadleys Hope (on a baron world void of natural lifeforms).. then once all Hosts are used... they can not create anymore.
This is a flaw that makes them not PERFECT...
If we also assume they dont live forever then eventually the colony would die out.... but can the Eggs Survive... yes in Alien but is that due to the containment field? But Star Beast suggested the Eggs/Spores can survive a long time... which then means it needs a helpless victim to stumble upon the Eggs/spores to kick start the procreation cycle.
So if the Xenomorph did not need a Host, and the Face Huger would evolve/transform into the Chest Buster then yes that would make them more Perfect.
We cant rule out them only needing Genetic Material for some means of Procreation... but we have seen no evidence of Procreation other than needing a Foreign Host (none Xeno Life Form)
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
Posted Aug-04-2016 11:37 PM
"If we also assume they dont live forever then eventually the colony would die out.... but can the Eggs Survive... yes in Alien but is that due to the containment field? But Star Beast suggested the Eggs/Spores can survive a long time... which then means it needs a helpless victim to stumble upon the Eggs/spores to kick start the procreation cycle."
I think the eggs could last eons without the blue laser, personally, which means the species can spring up once again and never really naturally become extinct. Another host comes along, they latch on and procreate. Which is why I liken them to cancer more than anything else.
It's a shame Ripley's reference to them as a cancer got cut from Resurrection.
Posted Jan-24-2017 1:43 AM
The alien seems to be a blend of a plant and an insect (having “the best” of both)? A cockroach is perhaps the best survivor (can stand different temperatures, pressure, can live long without food or air, can stand radiation etc) and has been on Earth får hundreds of millions of years. They are also laying eggs and can be parthenogenetic. Otherwise, when it comes to voraciousness and hostility, this creature springs to mind: :)
Posted Apr-15-2017 2:11 AM
Didn't they use the cancer angle in Aliens: Colonial Marines (shudder), in which they also inferred that the Chestburster cannot be removed as it would kill the host indirectly. While cancer is undoubtedly deadly it is only a competitor in the eyes of a virus - compare a cancer cell to a viral particle.
As for calling it the perfect organism, wouldn't that depend upon its purpose, it's role in an ecosystem. The cow is not the perfect organism, but it is the perfect livestock organism giving us leather, beef and milk (and by extension butter and cheese). Most would agree the Xenomorph is a biological weapon, in which respect it is the perfect "weapon" organism.
Lack of morals, no remorse, exoskeleton, parasitical - interesting many commonly use these words but avoid the classification that fits most, if not all of the Xenomorphs traits - insects; the second most dominant lifeform on our planet, and it was an insect, the parasitic wasp, that served as inspiration for the Xenomorph.
But for me personally, how would I classify the Xenomorph; with one word - human. As Agent Smith stated in The Matrix the human race procreates and affects its ecosystem in a similar fashion to that of a virus. But that aside, my suspicion is that if the crew of the USCSS Covenant ran the same test on a Xenomorph that Shaw ran on the decapitated Engineers head, I believe the results would be identical when tested against our own DNA, but we'll have to wait and see if my belief is right on that one...
Posted Apr-15-2017 3:29 AM
The Alien, going strictly from ALIEN itself, including the eggmorphing,pretty much defies Terrestrial classification. End of the movie it got blown out of a plasma drive, and was still bodily intact, possibly survived. Though canonically, according to an Interview with R. Scott it was at the end of it's life anyways, it had originally nested in the shuttle to die.
Granted, the Alien's only real weakness is needing a host to reproduce. BUT as it's a weapon, that's not a weakness, merely an aspect of it's Purpose.
Forget the Cameron-Idiocy of 'Lets make Alien into space ants!' as that's too simplistic, and the Queen is a massive weakness.
Drop 1 Egg into a city, and you have a nightmare exploding at a Geometric-squared rate. 1 Alien takes and converts say, 4 people into eggs, along with 4 captured hosts, before end of lifecycle. Those 4 newly birthed chestbursters then proceed to grow and do the same, but there's no central hive, no centralized reproduction center to kill. They'd all most likely go off and establish seperate nests. and let's say each of those takes 4 people for eggs, and 4 more as hosts, etc, etc.
You have something that is as Perfect as an organism can be structurally, capable of largely independent reproduction, as hostile and aggressive as it is structurally perfect, able to exist and operate in a wide range of conditions, including vacuum, it's extremely cunning, stealthy, and probably high-order animal-level intelligent.
Viruses = Not an organism.
Cancer = Not an organism.
*Man's giant leap was just a stumble in the dark.*
Posted Apr-19-2017 8:00 AM
The perfect organism? Perhaps one that remains in balance with nature yet retains sentience and the ability to creatively express itself?
in the alien universe, the perfect organism may refer to the original species that the xenomorph is derived from, or the xenomorph designed to eliminate planet and ship populations, its perfect for that purpose but its physiology would render it paralysed if one let a fire alarm off.
Posted Jun-25-2017 3:34 PM
Seeing how the Xenomorph evolved from the Xenovirus, and gestates as a parasitic embryo, it really has no known terrestrial analog. It has the characteristics of a virus, an organism, and an animal, an amalgamation of sorts. The Xenomorph is therefor an appendage of a being that would be a combination of the Hive Intelligence David explains that originates in the motes, and the virus/accelerant. Therefore, it would be considered most closely and unprofessionally a 'placental virus organism' or 'superorganism' when functioning in its latter, "hive" state. It also, via the xenovirus, is shown to be mutable, either naturally or preemptive-induction via third party (Engineers/David).
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