Deacon vs. Xenomorph confrontation in Alien: Covenant?

Honestly i really think its very possible

we will certainly see the adult deacon....and also some sort of queen lab made by either a david event or engineer homeworld creation event that kills the entire race.

i imagine this new kind of queen yet far more viscious...trigerring a lotta events...will be same size as a queen however i think much more scary and deadly aswell.

they going full ham on the new type of xeno.

Also is deacon able to reproduce itself...laying eggs aswell? inpregnate humans?

i think the deacon gonna have a major role because its a unique creation and mix...and i think in its adult state can be the most powerfull and deadly alien creature yet.

so at some point....if both deacon and the new xeno face each other...i dont think they will coexist or like each other

and i think the deacon is the creature taking the spotlight , might not be able to reproduce itself in the xeno traditional way ,i expect it to be the real threat that will play a major role on the upcoming movie.

Would be interesting.... but i am not sure we would see any Xeno vs Deacon...

I dont think we would see the Deacon again.... but i feel they need to cover LV-223 at some point... but im not sure we will in the next movie...

The Deacon i felt was a Plot Device to show what Engineer Bio-Weapon Goo can lead to as far as Xeno DNA, and by a set of events creates a Human/Xeno Hyrbid Face Huger, i have explained this in detail before (how the Deacon is more Human than Xeno)  so it was a plot device to show us a Engineers and experiments is connected to Space Jockey and Xeno...

Saying that i also think they was disapointed a bit with the Deacon... it was just not scary compared to the Xeno... or other concept works for Prometheus...

However the Deacon is a Mammal... its is more Mammal DNA than Xeno... (i can explain this in detail) and if we look at Mammals.... you have say what... Cute Baby, Cute Bear Cub, Cute Puppy, Cute Tiger Cub, Cute Gorilla Baby....

You get the picture.... then look at the most horrific and huge human beings, look at a big savage Dog or Wolf, a Fully Grown snarling Bear or Tiger a huge Gorilla...

And you can see the difference... so a Adult Deacon has the potential to look more threatening... but im not sure we shall ever see it again.

pleasee dont say that bigdave xD..you crushing my expectations..because it makes sense

lv223 is left there...the next movie doesnt have any reason to go back to it yet.

but ridley said 2 creatures one its new other isnt...so either we see the normal xenos or we see the deacon again....i bet on the second...i think normal xenos would be a creature to present on the final movie..specially because alien 5 is near aswell.

because i think its more human then beast i think deacon is more inteligent aswell...therefore could be a intersting plot to explore...a different specie that is vicscious powerfull but inteligent and autonomous...doesnt need a queen..doesnt have to obey to nothing...its a lone wolf.

fire and stone alien covenant has great ideas behind it...and deacon plays a big role on them.

what you think

Im not crushing them lol....  i agree LV-223 has to be covered at some point.

As far as.. "but ridley said 2 creatures one its new other isnt"

Ridley never said this... i posted this on here as from a source in March, at the time Ridley was banging on about No More Gods and Dragons... the Alien was always a Dragon, its been done over and over only so much snarling you can do, and the movie should follow Shaw and David and what they find out about the Engineers..

The Source informed me there would be 2 Monsters.. One New (never seen before) both related to the Xeno but different.... he said the Xeno is X, Monster A and B are related to the X the Xeno you can see the similarities... but A and B are different.... they said that Monster B is from a new event after the events of Prometheus and at the hands of David.

he never said nowt about Monster A only its a older event... they never said its the Deacon... or events of Prometheus... just before the end of the movie.. so could be a event in 2093 or a event thousands of years ago...

Only detailed the New Monster and described it as based of Gigers Necromonicon 4 and that Spaights Alien Engineers draft was using the same idea for the Ultramorph...

It was after i was told this... that Ridley a month or so latter released that they are trying to introduce a fresher form of the Monster.. in the 3rd Act, one that would go back to resemble the Original Monster..... which means he felt the Alien after Alien i.e Aliens, Alien 3 Alien R and AVP movies Xenomorph was different to the Original idea....

Ridley at that time hinted they wanted something New and the Xeno we all know and love WILL NOT APEAR... Not in Prometheus 2 or 3 none of them...

There seems a U-Turn now though...

So here is a hunch.... i suspected they was hinting to showing us a new Monster created by David with the Cargo he was carrying that would create something New.... something a bit fresh...

We would then see something old explored... i thought maybe LV-223 would be explored as its a loop hole but hints seem to be regards to LV-223 as in past event, prior to Prometheus.. thus the OLDER Monster is something that was on LV-223 thousands of years ago.. or Paradise thousands of years ago and as a Clue to the Xeno Origins but it would not be the Xenomorph, something similar created thousands of years ago...

Could it be something different, but then did the something New mean after Prometheus.. thus other was old? or merely New was in a event after Prometheus and so the other was a event prior and so maybe not OLD .. but then they said related to the Xeno and not the Xeno.

This could mean the Mural Organism?, the Fresco? or something else that is genetically related to the Xenomorph..

Well we now know it's 10 years after Prometheus.  Weyland Industries has probably sent a rescue party to LV-223...so I suppose we could get some LV-223 Deacon action?.....But it really sounds like the next movie is about a new planet(LV -???) and another new/old monster.

BUT.......David still has the Deacons mother(Miss Shaw)with him....Would David experiment on Shaw? Maybe he created something really monstrous using Shaw's DNA or her body.

Covenant crew: "David you wanted to show us something?"

David: Smiling slightly "Yes....I want you to meet a friend of mine...Isn't she beautiful?"

A large spider creature decended from the cavern's ceiling. It drove a spike through the head of Lt. Norris...He all but exploded. The creature vomited acid towards the remaining dumbstruck Covenant crew.

Would not post this on 17th December so here is a retry.

I dont think we may see the Deacon... im kind of 30/70 as far as Will/Wont...

I think it could and should be explored... LV-223 has to be, for certain... i have give reasons in the other thread http://www.scified.com/topic/41317

As far as those Ridley comments..... they are not exactly what he said, he has hinted similar...

 Those comments are actually supposed leaks from a source someone i know had spoken too, i had been given a lot of information between end of March and June...  which i had in part put on here, and in part kept off here but via PM to a selected few on here because the source did not want information out there lol OPPS!

When i had the information, it was odd, some never added up... some did... they gave information to the movie being about more than Shaw and David, they play a small role well Shaw does, she is incapacitated in the movie for most part... they said the Engineers are not Gods, and there is multiple levels to Gods, Hierarchy and at the top is what they say is a Force/Power than a being, but they said not like God... they had said yes we shall see two Organisms related to the Xeno both are different from each other...

So Xeno is X and Organism A and B are related to X but A and B are different to each other... one is new and from a new event after prometheus one is from a old event. The new one is at the hands of David, and its a fresh take on the Necromon 4 Giger work which the concept for Ultramorph was in Spaights draft that was not used....

There was many more stuff said.. like 3 Plot points,  3 movies total....  even how Prometheus name is to be dropped from Paradise Lost or Pandemonium and toyed with Dark Paradise name too....

As July to September came a lot of stuff Ridley was saying started to add up to what i was told...

In March i was told, about Production start time and shooting, and budget and a bigger cast.. and after september... Ridley had confirmed things that matched this...

So many things i was told but they was vague... in a way Ridley is... and they said in March expect around Fall for information to come out and confirm the movie is happening and that come November to expect big news and information to start to come out...  Low and Behold it did.

The last thing they said its that they have no information since March...

Its funny that all things kind of added up.... then BANG!  Alien Covenant was anounced and a synopsis that does not match everything Ridley had said about the Sequel over the years right upto a week before Covenant....

Funny enough few weeks before Alien 5 is offically on back burner after being given months before a Green Light and Production in 2016....

John Logan as of annoucement of Covenant, is brought in to re-work the draft for the next movie.

And confirmed January 2016 Shooting and May 2017 release dates (which i was told about in March) had now been pushed to April/May 2016 Shooting and October 2017 release date.

seems Alien 5 has had some ideas changed, and Prometheus 2 changed so that both movies to not tread on each others toes, and now potentially shall directly link.... thus  the main plot of Alien: Covenant will be a prequel to Alien 5 plot.  then the sequels to Alien Covenant will work backwards from before Alien to Prometheus.. finally with another that would touch upon the Engineers History and LV-223 Outbreak and Space Jockey...

This is based off limited information the source gave (he claims that the new direction is different to original a bit, and when looking how Alien 5 is also changed a bit, then it seems both movies are being re-wrote as far as some changes to fit intogether).  so using this and clues from Ridley and other information i then have a few times put on here what i think is going on...

Feel Free to PM about anything related to them... Prometheus, Alien.. etc..

MonsterZero

LOL i love how you like to do stories to your theories.. ;)

Yes i think they have to explore LV-223 its a no brainer... as you have to ask yourself... in 2094 we are left with a World that is not far from LV-426 a World that had many more Engineer Temples, at least a few more within a short distance from where Prometheus went down..  There are many more Engineer Ships (David confirmed this) We have the Temple the Prometheus crew Explored and it has left many Questions.. and yet there is so much more to explore, they never scratched the Surface of that Complex... how come the air was breathable what was behind the Deacon Mural... another Tomb? What was the Altar and Green Crystal for?

Nevermind what becomes of all that Black Goo, the Hamerpedes, the Deacon...

Surely the company would want to try at some point between 2094 and 2179 go back and find out what happened to Prometheus.. where they would detect Shaws SOS and would they stay away?  You bet they wont... and they would find the Lifeboat and want to explore it to see if any records had been made by David and the Crew...

where they would find the dead Engineer and dead Trillobite... surely the company Science division would love to study them...

But in Alien and Aliens and after... there was no mention of Engineers, why would they persue the Xeno via LV-426 and indeed after that by going after Ripley on Fiorina 161 never mind Clone her hundreds of years latter in the Persuit of the XENOMORPH?

When LV-223 has many more Rewards and Riches.....

This Plot Hole/Loop Hole has to be explored... before they can proceed with Alien 5 unless Alien 5 recovers its Engineer Tech and Xenomorph from LV-223?

MonsterZero...

As far as Shaw, then yes its possible she has some Xeno DNA in her body... especially if are led to believe that the DNA from Hair prehapse of Ripley can lead to a Clone that is carrying a Xeno Queen (yep most stupid idea about Alien R).

Shaw is missing in the next movie... but she has a minor part....  this is a waste of potential, look at the dynamic between the two (David and Shaw) and now we get a new Female Lead and a link to Ripley?  And we forget about Shaw..?  No thanks and i hope thats not the case.

Covenant takes place 10 years after, so its the year 2104...  that 10 year Gap a lot could have gone down... and the premise for a sequel was always Shaw and Davids Dynamic and situation and then the trip to find these Engineers for Answers... are they going to drop all of this?

10 years is a long time for the Engineer Ship to reach Paradise.. and then for David to unleash Hell and then the Covenant come across the Aftermath.  So i think at some point in a latter movie and maybe a few scenes in the next leading to futher expansion in the next movie after Covenant... for us to see what events transpired within that 10 year time frame.

If not then its a absolute throw away... and if LV-223 is not covered then again what a mess the whole Franchise will become... these things have to be COVERED!

I cant see another 3 movies starting with Covenant and the crew of this ship what? 10-30 Humans finding David and something Evolving can then lead us to have 3 movies of the aftermath of this encounter and show us the Xeno Origins and how it got to LV-426 and the Space Jockey some 18 years after Covenant...

3 movies for all that?    When there are bigger things left uncovered...

3 movies to to cover 18 years, David, a Xenomorph (or number of them) some related Organisms and a crew of Human Colonists that will lead to Alien and explain it all.... without covering LV-223 the outbreak 2000 years ago, the Engineers and who they are and what was there Agenda?

I cant see that happening.... not when if they do.. what does Alien 5 and a 6 and maybe a 7 do.. cover the Xeno again?

If this is the case, then no Thanks.... i think more AVP movies have better chance of a better Story if they Reboot them within the timeframe of the Games i.e 2100-2300 Time Frame.

Back to the Topic.... Xeno vs Deacon!

As far as the Organism at the end of Prometheus? i doubt it... unless some Humans, Engineers or Androids uncover more Engineer ships that contain Xeno Eggs or a event that leads to them... or the Deacon itself creates the Eggs...

But we need something fresh.....  we have 3 potential Fresh Ideas from LV-223 Maybe 4.

1) We have the Hamerpedes... we saw 2 but there was about 5 in that Goo, and the Goo Flooded the Big Head Room.... there is potential for more Hammerpedes... and so what becomes of its life Cycle? 

* Was the Hamerpede its Adult Form?

* Can the Hamerpede Egg Morph, or evolve living tissue to become something else? Like a Butterfly?  Or do the Hamerpedes themselves grow a bit more and enter some kind of like Pupa Stage Caterpillars?

* Can they procreate like Worms and thus reproduce eggs without the need for a sexual partner? (Parthenogenesis) or do they need a Host?

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* What becomes of the Deacon, as it is part Human... does it reproduce like the Xeno Queen and Lay Eggs?

* Does it Egg Morph, or evolve living tissue to become something else?

* Maybe it has Human traits, and births a child like the Queen in Alien R did with the New Born, and how fast the Xeno Life Cycle is maybe this Deacon can Grow to Adult within 24-48 hours and reproduce one of its own every 24-48 hours who in turn can reproduce?

* Maybe this process needs a host or host DNA, so maybe the Deacon needs to obtain DNA somehow to perfom either of the above points?  Like Sil did from Species? how horrifc would it be if the Deacon has some Organ or apparatus that needs to optain some DNA.

Note in Alien there was a scene that was never fully shown where the Xenomorph sounded like it Raped Lambert.... but maybe it needed to extact something from her to allow its to Egg Morph Brett?  This would make for a interesting set of scenes... so what if the Deacon does the same?

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* We see what happened to the Worms, Fifield and so what else can the Goo do, and what is contained in the other Temples or on the other Jugernaughts?  More Goo... or experiments evolved and created from the Goo.

So yes LV-223 has MASSIVE SCOPE for giving us something more FRESH!

Does the Deacon need food? How is it going to survive? Might be able to live off the cryo sleeping Engineers(if there are any left?).

Unless fresh meat arrives soon?

Plenty of water on Lv 223....so that's okay.....

Maybe it can eat Hamerpedes? Like BigDave said: The planet might be crawling/slithering with billions of Hamerpedes!

This is one of those things we just cant be sure of..

Ridley had hinted the Xenomorph has a limited Life Span.... but it would be logical the Queen has a longer one... if we consider Ants/Bees or better still Termites the Queen has a vastly longer life span.

But the Deacon has Human DNA... does this mean it has a life span like a Human and this upto 100 years, does it live longer.... can it hybernate? Does it go into a Pupa stage that remains dormant?   Untill it detects life?

Can it use Genetic Material to create a Egg Morph (have to remember im sure in the Alien book or draft that the Xeno had killed Bret, and Star Beast it had eaten a part of the crew) and so it does not need a living Host to create a Egg Morph just genetic material and well it has some of that with the Dead Engineer, or even dead Vickers if it finds her.

The possibilities are many....

Looking however at Alien DC and Star Beast it would appear the Organism needed maybe Food and also a body be that dead or alive to then use as a way to procreate...  In Aliens we got the Queen who lays Eggs but we are never showed if it needs anything to be able to do so as far as nutrition/food.

So which aspect can we place on the Deacon? or does it have neither requirement or both?

Man, I sure do love this idea Chris! But now...its unlikely :(

I wonder if we are going to see "God" in this movie. If so, its gonna be interesting to see its relationship to xenos and other creatures. An infected god...

Think i will give this a Bump!

I have taken the Concept work for Fire and Stone of the Deacon's we NEVER got to see and Scaled in a Xenomorph.

The Fire and Stone Concept Team seemed to be going for about a 10-11Ft Fully Grown Engineer Deacon.

Bare in Mind this is Comic Format... i think we can assume IF we saw a Real Action Adult Deacon in a Future Movie it would look more Fearsome than the Concepts show.

We know NOTHING really about the Deacon, it surely would share some Traits of the Neomorph and Xenomorph.

While we can ASSUME a Xenomorph would beat a Neomorph (which is the case in a Earlier Draft)  I would Speculate that the Engineer Deacon would be more of a Match for a Human Xenomorph.

What do you think about this Interpretation (by Harnois75) of the ORIGINAL DEACON from the Mural?

This 12ft Monstrosity would make a Formidable Beast and likely be too much of a Match for the Xenomorph but NOT the Queen.