ancient aliens

That is a good idea...

I do think one logical reason for the Engineers to not return would be that after they was upset with us, they then tried to reset us, but save a few a number of times, but then after one last chance they decided to pull the plug.

Only the plans was to instead use Earth as a test for a new kind of upgrade, this proved costly to them (LV-223 outbreak and LV 426 Space Jockey)

That as a race that has created many other worlds, they decided instead of comming to destroy Earth they would just chalk it as a failed experiment and allow us to Rot..

Knowing our Warlike Race would destroy itself, and without the Engineers help we would never evolve beyond what they had taught us so long ago, that there is no way on its own Mankind would evolve to ever conquer the stars.

That could explain why the Engineers, their creators or Hiarachy ever bothered to come back to us, and if we ever did manage to travel the stars the frist place we would go would be where the Star Maps are...

Where we would face our Death.... maybe they felt the left overs of the outbreak that surely proved costly for their advanced race, would be far too much a match for Mankind and thus we would not be able to Harvest the secrets even if we managed to obtain Space Travel, and also Paradise is so far away that Mankind could not possibly get their or even known of where it would be.

Or simply they never ever thought we would ever get into Space...

This kind of story is one way to cover some plot holes...

But their is another as surely once David and Shaw get to Paradise the Engineers and/or their creators would know about our creation then (if they did not) and that mankind can travel the stars and even create life in our own image (David) who can obtain and use Engineer Tech....

This would surely not sit well with these Godlike beings and surely we have to ask why after this event did they not come to destroy mankind or visit us after the events of Alien or even as far in future as Alien Resurection...

One explanation could be it would take them so long to get to us that they would not get to Earth by time of Alien Resurection, which could also mean David and Shaw dont get to Paradise before the events of Aliens and Alien 3.

Another is something happens that destroys the Engineers at the hands of David... and Ridley did say he is bringing HELL with him...

I think that everybody loves the Ancient Alien theme because deep down, we know that our existance is more than just a number of different "coincidences" that led to our evolution. At first, i wasn't happy with the way Ridley made the Space Jockey a part of our history. ALIEN always seemed so alien to me, like that space jockey and his kind had never been anywhere near earth nevermind interacted with humans and played a part in our creation.

However, over the last two years i have changed my views on it. What could be more sinister and scary than finding some fossilized alien on some god forsaken planetoid and not even realise that it and it's kind played an hand in our existance? That is what i think now when i watch ALIEN.

@BigDave; I find it amazing that you have over 3 thousand posts, most of which are ideas! If you made a film or wrote a book, it would be one serious mind f**k! I mean that in a good way! :)

Cheers Necromon, i have loads of ideas, and i dont sleep lol i have a rare sleeping disorder and i always instead just think constantly of different stuff like dreams but i am awake, and its usually various fantasy or Sci Fi stuff, i basically do like in my head nightly TV shows if you know what i mean lol.

I have always had a creative mind, but my English is not good, but yes i am British but my english is not good i am a bit Dyslexic, and my spelling is not to good never mind gramar, and i often put words in places where other words are supposed to go and as i type so fast, unless i proof read after i dont spot the mistakes. 

I make mistakes when i write as well (hand writting) my handwritting is messy and sometimes i get ahead of myself so i would write a word say  Prometheus, but on paper i would put some of the letters that appear after others before or miss letters... so on paper i would put Promthus.. if you know what i mean.

I had in the past taken interest in Warhammer Games, and years and years ago i used to come up with cool ideas for various new equipment options for units and even new units and rules and back ground, it would be a ace idea, but they was kept to myself.. then like years latter some 5 or more after i had a lot of ideas, then Games Workshop started to produce new units that was similar or the same as mine, someone must have had same ideas latter and funny enough the rules for them was not far off mine... so my made up rules was actually not far off what they officially would have allowed years latter.

Saying that mind... i have a high IQ last 3 tests came back 143, 146 and 153 lol

As far as the whole Ancient Aliens concept, it is a interesting one, but a tricky one.. Sadly i think they released the Task they was taking on was a very large SCOPE but also a Poisoned Challace, and they are now stepping away from such a thing.

If they had gone for what many of us saw the Space Jockey as before Prometheus, and that being some Ancient Alien Race in a (Space Suit) which i always saw it a bit of, and Ridley confirmed... or a Ancient Giant Skeleton which many thought it was including early Comics and its what Star Beast had....

Regardless of the Space Suit or Skeleton, what for certain was it appeared this was a Pilot of some Ancient Alien Bomber, or Bio Weapon Cargo Ship that was on its way to a destination before it got infected with the Cargo...

And that this Alien Race may had been involved in some War with another Race, or its own kind and maybe this Space Jockey had drifted well off course from where the conflict was happening and crashed landed on a Baron Moon and informed his kind that the Cargo had been comprimised and mission failed.

By going that route, and they could even had gave us Engineers as they appear but have it that they steared clear of them ever being behind the creation of Mankind and visits to us and then to had then set off to destroy us...

This would have been a story that would have been more easy to tell and one that you would not have had to tread on carefully so as to not leave plot holes etc.

Alas they took the former route, and while its interesting one, its one they barely scratched the surface, and one that the deleted Scenes and never shown scenes seemed to highlight in more detail and promise...

But one they now seem to be tonning down and stearing away from.

i do wish there was some way to go all the way with the Earthly origins concept without offending any particular race or religion. They've already bit it off. Time to chew it! Some kind of revalation made by scientists that unifies the world to stop the Engineers from wiping us out, with an end result being acceptance of other peoples religions because of the understanding they all came from the same source (or sighting!) A quick montage is all you need!

I'm basically saying what i think we all have wanted to see this whole time is a GOOD movie that brings this fight home! 

more Close Encounters than Independance Day of course.

"Love the one you're with" could also sum it up if Weyland had prepared a planet for us to move to so he could profit, and let the Earth harvest Aliens for his interest, but the human race fights to save and stay on Earth!

We win in the end with the last minute help from Shaw and David's new bio weapons they come back with!

I know there was outrage from some people about the movie, but for the love of God (parden the pun) some of these are so extream in their view, that even movies like Gods and Kings and Noah would caused outrage.

I think they will not go the route of dropping hints like anything related to the Bible etc, and about life after death, although these was the Questions Ridley set out to ponder about as opposed to a Movie about some Giant Race who created or experimented on the Xeno as a Bio Weapon.....

To be honest, they could still go the Engineers created us route and how Ancient man worshiped them as God like beings.... as long as they dont go the route of touching upon Jesus or Islam they would be fine....

As the few who would get offended get offended by mention of other ancient cultures anyway, the mention of Greek Gods, Hindu etc... they just count them all as being well False Gods who are actually Demons.

And well thats the route they could go, remember Ridley did refer to our Engineers and especially those on LV 223 as Fallen Angels AKA Demons.

those are some good words for thought, Big Dave!

This just came to me: What if Weyland Co. wants to barter a deal with the Engineers to use their bio weapons to clear out planets before they terraform/ colonize?!!!

This would be interesting and it would be something that i am sure Weyland company would want, however what would be in it for the Engineers.... surely to them Mankind is no  greater to them as Swine is to us.?

I definitely think Weyland would wonder what  happened to Prometheus, and they also know of the LV 426 Signal, and surely from Prometheus to Alien ships would have traveled closer and picked up Shaws Signal too...

I am sure that LV 223 and all the Tech and Bio Weapons there is more apealing that the continious failed persuit of the Xeno.....

Im just not sure they would be covering the Ancient Aliens plot in the next movie, they may give us clues as far as David reading Engineer Archaeological finds on Paradise, but not as far as any interaction between Engineers and Earth in modern times.

i think they should just go ahead and have us all wpied out, and a new Alien/Human hybrid species created here on earth, and make some classic sci fi "what if" scenarios out of that!

thanks Dave for your insight. Im constantly thinking about this movie!

No problem....

I cant see what you said as happening mind......

But i do think that was the intention of the Engineers, we have to ask why do they seed their DNA, why are we created in the Engineers image? In Spaights draft the Human Evolution was a more rabid one and it was simply by a Early Primates DNA being upgrades with Engineers that led to Mankind....  so they used their DNA to create life, and especially Mankind and they held a importance to us, like visit us etc.

But at some point, they was not pleased with us, but more than that at some point maybe some of the Engineers got infected with something related to the Xeno, and this brought about a Chest Buster that produced a Deacon, different to Shaws.

What if this caused some Engineers to then see that this event allowed them to give Birth to new Life, and the resulting Organism (Child) they saw as a very interesting Organism that had DNA traits our Engineers felt could be of great use, or maybe after a while of experimenting or maybe after seeing some results they then saw the Deacon as a more Perfect DNA than their own Engineers.

And thus felt that using the Hybrid Engineer/Xeno related DNA to evolve life is a better option than just the Engineers DNA.

Ooh, maybe WE bursted from chests of the early primates that were seeded here, and WE were the accident! Maybe they wanted to see what we evolved into, and how effective we might be as a bio weapon! Maybe what  we have done here on earth somehow threatens their existance!

That would explain the one engineers urgency to get the fuck right back here when he woke up! He was on a mission!

We dont know the Agenda of the Engineers, but the unseen dialog from the Elders Scene and by that full scene and not what we got in the deleted section, does sugest that the Engineers seeded their DNA for some purpose for the greater or their good.

The translated dialog was “Let your body become the dirt. Your blood become the waters. And may your soul become their way back to us.”

Elder Engineer Speaks

What we have to consider is what ever Agenda the Script was trying to vaguely show us could not be changed, and maybe there are reasons the Elder Scenes was cut and Engineers was portrayed...

To me they had been tonned down to be mearly Pawns.

But going to the Sacrifical Scene, it to me seemed to had been set Millions and not thousands of years back and that it was the start of Evolution of Life and not a more direct route to Mankind as Spaights draft more rapid Evolution was.. i.e From Primate to infected with Engineer DNA to Mankind.

So the Prometheus scene could leave the path for them creating life, surely they had done this before?  But the result of Mankind could that had been a accident?  Did they expect our creation from the process after thousands or millions of years?

It does leave room for the Engineers to had came back and re-engineered life again, constantly chossing lifeforms and upgrading them... Ridley said the Engineers had been back many times to upgrade us, not only Technologically but Genetically.

We dont know what exact route they was taking or where they are not going (Fox and Ridley) But there is no reason as to why one potential could be that a faction of Engineers came back to the Seeded Earth and then genetically upgraded he evolved life to become more Engineer DNA and also taught us stuff...

Was doing this against the wishes of the Elders or the Original Agenda? Do the hierarchy on Paradise know about what was done or our creation?

These are the many things that could be answered...

As far as us being their creators, thats a interesting idea but i am not sure its one they would explore, some other ideas i heard was that the Engineers are us but from the future after we genetically Engineer ourselves to far that we can procreate....

While i dont think they are us from the future, as well that opens up a whole as to why go back to the very start? 

It could instead  mean that these Engineers had evolved themselves so they can not procreate and the creation of Mankind was a way to allow them to breed in future or for some purpose to the Procreation of their kind.

But the idea of more Humans is a good one or human related, as well we dont know how many other Worlds these Engineers had seeded, the hints by Ridley is they have done so on many worlds.

It does appear that our Engineers are more clone like, however they are not all exactly the same, their appearence does differ.... not including the Elders, of whom two who was shot up close look different i,e vary in appearence more...

The actual younger Engineers while looking alike they also differ abit, but these differences are minor, they lack the diversity that Mankinds appearence does.

But then with mankind its a racial thing as some races do not have as varried look as some other races. I.e some races features are more uniform and similar.

These Engineers seem to lack even that diversity much like we see with Primates, while there are differences, they are not as vast... maybe like neanderthal man, in which Science sugests they pretty much had more uniform characteristics.

And the Engineers appeared likewise they was not quite Clones as a Clone would be identical, but i am sure there is some kind of clonning going on to a degree.

I think my previous post may had been intended for another Topic.... lol but has some relevance..

As far as the theat to their existance, i think if they intended us the way was was back 1000 or 2000 years ago plus,  we may had fallen out of favour with them....

There is some reason they wanted us destroyed..

And my interpretation of Prometheus especially if we consider the unshown scenes... is that maybe the Last Engineer could have or been part of a team that sabotaged the mission to destroy us.

Feeling instead we should just be left to our own devices and our own downfall and destruction, rather than be wipped out or upgraded with some new favoured DNA.

But upon being awoken the Last Engineer would now know, that Mankind has evolved on our own with no help from the Engineers to be able to travel the Stars and find LV 223.

While watching Weyland he would have noticed that he has kind of the leader/king role and that only his own Agenda matters and not that of the Questions Shaw was asking... at this point the Engineer would see that mankind was Selfish.

Upon studying David, and what Weyland was saying and how he wanted more life, the Engineer would know that mankind is greedy and wants to be as Gods, and had taken steps to that by creating life in their own Image (David)

This Life can read the Engineers writting and language....

Thus the Engineer at that point knows, mankind can travel the stars,  its is a selfish and greedy race, and that it has created life itself and that using this creation they could interpret and use all the Engineer Tech and Sectrets on LV 223 and become as GODS.

The Engineer then realised that indeed the mission that had failed years before, must now be resumed and Mankind can not be left alone in the Universe because of the impact we would have on the Galaxy and especially of we optained any Engineer Technology.

Actually, Big Dave my last post kind of matches your first response in this thread;

they reset us afew times- chest bursting ( evolution ), and we are a bio weapon, wiping ourselves out!

sorry im just reading your last two responses now, didnt realize we were on a page two!

you've given me alot to think about. i must stew on this a while, thanks!

Yeah its a interesting idea...

One that some on here thought about as far as why we was created, so that we can then be used to become Xenos?

But then why? Because they worship Xenos? Sorry but the movie clues shows us our Engineers as a Advanced Race, the Sacrifical Scene and Ancient Alien connections shows us they may have had some advanced Culture...

The Xeno on the other hand seems to be portrayed as a life form that has basic survival and procreation instincts.. but is perfect for that function...

The other idea was that they harvest DNA from us after we are infected....

Surely a advanced race has better ways to harvest our DNA than the method of using Xenos on us....  Especially when we see that messing with the Xeno and its DNA had proved fatal to the Engineers not only the Space Jockey but also the LV 223 outbreak.

The other idea some had was that we get Morphed into Eggs like in Alien DC and the Engineers come down and collect the Eggs so they have new stash of Bio Weapons..

This would make more sense if we throw out the Queen.... but even so, we know the Engineers again had difficulty in keeping themselves safe from these Experiments to create the Bio Weapon and also that transporting Eggs was risky business...

The other idea was the Xenos are Gods, and the Engineers are used to procreate their kind, and the Engineers may then had created us so that we can procreate their Gods instead...

Nice idea, but again as my 1st of the above points, i dont see the Xeno as a more advanced culture!

The idea i am drawn to is that these Engineers create life, they upgrade life for some purpose... but they are Genetic Engineers, Genetic Gardeners and we are one of the many Fruits/Flowers they created...

They seed their DNA so that life created carries their DNA, as they have superiour DNA.

But what if a faction of them either created something, or came across something or created something from experiments on something they came across...

And by accident a Deacon was born....

This Chest Buster allowed one of their kind to give birth to new life in a way maybe the Engineers lost?

They found this fascinating, and they futher went to experiment on the DNA of the Xeno to produce different new types of Fruit/Flowers...

Until the result was the Deacon in the Mural.... at this point they saw this Hybrid Creature as the Perfect Lifeform... it had both Engineers DNA and Xeno. and at some point the Engineers on LV 223 saw that seeding Worlds with this Hyrbid DNA was more favourable than Engineers DNA.

the Deacon had Shaw's DNA as well as the Engineer's DNA. Although similar, maybe the mix also intrigued the Engineers, and hence their need for us...?

Thats interesting and we cant be sure for certain, every peice of clue, and especially if we take clues from the Alien movies, Star Beast Draft, the Spaights Alien Engineers Draft, they can all lead us all down a different path depending on interpretation.

The Deacon had Engineer DNA for sure, we dont know what % but if we look at it being Human Terms or Different Race on Earth Terms without sounding Racist...

If we had a Person who was born from African Father, and a White Mother they would be Half Afro/Europeon...  now if this person then has a child to a Asian (Chinese) Male the result would be in theory Half Chinese, 25% African and 25% White Europeon.

My point being that if the process of DNA passing is the same as Humans, then our Deacon would be 25% Human, 25% Xeno and 50% Engineer.

Where as the Original Alien that we had in the movies, when infecting a Human Host gave us say 50% Xeno and 50% Human DNA..

But as i said thats based on Human DNA passing traits and so the Xeno etc and everything we see in the movie may be a different ratio... i.e  a Xeno Face Huger plus Human Host may not produce a 50/50 DNA.

As far as the need for us goes, Originally my conclusion from all the clues, in the franchise including Star Beast,  leads me more down the path that the Engineers DNA is used to create Life and also to evolve life to make Humanoids close to themselves i.e Mankind.

But some event led to the creation of a Deacon, well a Organism maybe that produced a Chest Buster from a Engineer and they saw a part Engineer DNA and part Xeno DNA Hyrbid,  and they either found this Organism interesting and its DNA Perfect, or they carried out experiments with the results to then create something Perfect.

And regardless this is the Mural Deacon and thus a Organism who the Engineers then saw its DNA as better than that of the Engineers DNA, and then they use this to then seed and upgrade life with rather than Engineer DNA.

But it seems Fox and Ridley are going a diferent route, one that could send us down the path that our Engineers are created to be hosts to produce the Deacon or various Bio Weapons for some purpose..

And the Engineers then decided hang on... if we create a race in our Image we can then use them to become the Hosts and not us....

Maybe they did this to save them being used as such, by their creators, and maybe the results they intended maybe to use against their creators?

Would be like David 8s to come to be like "why should we serve mankind? We are superiour so why dont we create a more simple Robot that can take the place of our chores and purposes, and we then take out Mankind and replace them"